Taiwanese vegetarians: no garlic or onions?

[Lili]

Why on earth do Taiwanese people who consider themselves "vegetarian" refuse to eat garlic and onions as well?
Do they know it comes from?

[maoman]

Why on earth do Taiwanese people who consider themselves "vegetarian" refuse to eat garlic and onions as well?
Do they know it comes from?

It's a Buddhist thing, not a vegetarian thing. That is to say, they're vegetarian because they're Buddhist. the garlic and onions thing also comes from that, not from vegetarianism. I think because it "angers up the blood".

[Lili]

Why on earth do Taiwanese people who consider themselves "vegetarian" refuse to eat garlic and onions as well?
Do they know it comes from?

It's a Buddhist thing, not a vegetarian thing. That is to say, they're vegetarian because they're Buddhist. the garlic and onions thing also comes from that, not from vegetarianism. I think because it "angers up the blood".

OH!
So why dont they just say they are Buddhist so dont eat it?
They are always saying "Im vegetarian so I dont eat it." and Im always like yet they still insist its a vegetarian thing.

[Tempo Gain]

Happened to read this the other day, it might help clarify things a bit:

http://www.communitycenter.org.tw/sites ... il2012.pdf

[Nagunae]

I have a German vegetarian friend who eats what can best be described as garlic sandwiches. He just shook his head when I told about this. By the way, I believe it's the "full vegetarian" in Tempo Gain's article that describes this type of vegetarianism.

[Lili]

Happened to read this the other day, it might help clarify things a bit:

http://www.communitycenter.org.tw/sites ... il2012.pdf

I just forwarded that to a Western vegetarian friend who has a hard time here in Taiwan sometimes.
Thanks

[Dragonbones]

Lili, vegetarianism is a complex phenomenon, with different interpretations and practices across the world. It's not as simplistic as 'don't eat meat'. if you have a look at this Wiki page
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhist_vegetarianism
and search for the word 'garlic' to see the scriptural prohibitions, you'll get a better understanding of one Buddhist form, common here.

Chinese, Korean, and Vietnamese traditionsIn China, Korea and Vietnam, monks are expected to eat no meat. In Taiwan, Buddhist monks, nuns, and most lay followers eat no animal products or the fetid vegetables - traditionally garlic, Allium chinense, asafoetida, shallot, and Allium victorialis (victory onion or mountain leek), although in modern times this rule is often interpreted to include other vegetables of the onion genus, as well as coriander - this is called Su vegetarianism

According to the story of the Nirvana Sutra, a Mahayana Buddhist scripture purporting to give the Buddha's final teachings, the Buddha insisted that his followers should not eat any kind of meat or fish, even those not included in the 10 types, and that even vegetarian food that has been touched by meat should be washed before being eaten. Also, it is not permissible for the monk or nun just to pick out the non-meat portions of a diet and leave the rest: the whole meal must be rejected.[6]"One who eats meat kills the seed of great compassion... O Kasyapa! I, from now on, tell my disciples to refrain from eating any kind of meat. O Kasyapa! When one eats meat, this gives out the smell of meat while one is walking, standing, sitting or reclining. People smell this and become fearful. This is as when one comes near a lion. One sees and smells the lion, and fear arises. O good man!

When one eats garlic, the dirty smell is unbearable. Other people notice it. They smell the bad smell. They leave that person and go away. Even from far off, people hate to see such a person. They will not come near him. It is the same with one who eats meat.

It is a similar situation with all people who, on smelling the meat, become afraid and entertain the thought of death. All living things in the water, on land and in the sky desert such a person and run away. They say that this person is their enemy. Hence the Bodhisattva does not eat meat."

It looks to me like Gautama was using the "stench" of garlic to explain why they should not eat meat, and this negative portrayal of garlic found its way into monastic and lay prohibitions, which were extended to similar pungent and spicy vegetables. I've heard lay Buddhist vegetarians here describe the reason as 太刺激 tai4 ci4ji1, too stimulating, irritating or provoking.

[Bu Lai En]

It's an example of a translation which is close but different.

'Su' (素) is not exactly the same as 'vegetarian' but it's close enough that it's usually translated as such.

'Su' really means following the Buddhist dietary prescriptions, the most notable of which is not eating meat.

[belgian pie]

But if everyone eats garlic and onions than there is no problem with being 'smelly' ...

Buddhists here als don't eat pepper and other 'stimulating' spices.


Well, in India there are people that don't eat vegetables that have been grown underground ...

[Bu Lai En]

But if everyone eats garlic and onions than there is no problem with being 'smelly' ...

Buddhists here als don't eat pepper and other 'stimulating' spices.


Well, in India there are people that don't eat vegetables that have been grown underground ...

Pepper and spices are fine. It's just garlic, spring onions, chives.

[Dragonbones]

I've heard some people here mention chili peppers (la4jiao1) as part of the verboten group.

[belgian pie]

But if everyone eats garlic and onions than there is no problem with being 'smelly' ...

Buddhists here als don't eat pepper and other 'stimulating' spices.


Well, in India there are people that don't eat vegetables that have been grown underground ...

Pepper and spices are fine. It's just garlic, spring onions, chives.

No it's not

[divea]

There is the Sattvic Diet,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sattvic_diet

the Rajasic diet and then the Tamasic diet

http://www.mind-and-body-yoga.com/tamasic-foods.html

A lot of Taiwanese are not only just Buddhists but practice meditation and are majorly into Yoga too. Jainism, takes the Sattvic diet concept seriously, Hindus resort to it in times of illness and Buddhists do that during de-toxification or sometimes make it a way of life. But Jains are extremely sensitive about it.

Hindus feel that onions and garlic, the Tamas element is needed in food, so that we are able to rest. That is why you go into an Ayurvedic spa, you are served simple food and yet you come out feeling nourished!

[Bu Lai En]

There may be varying codes in different kinds of Buddhism of course, but for the vast majority, the forbidden foods (aside form meat) are spring onions, onions, chives and variations of such.

Peppers and chillies are DEFINITELY not forbidden in any Buddhist code that is at all widely practiced in Taiwan. Go to any Buddhist vegetarian buffet in Taipei and you will find these in abundance. I'm vegetarian, my wife's Buddhist and I know plenty of practicing Buddhist vegetarians, and I am sure about this.

[Tempo Gain]

Yeah they may not be widely used, but there's usually a tub of hot sauce available, and some dishes include hot peppers. Like the dougan hot peppers and peanuts at Mingde, yum.

Peppers were a relatively recent introduction from the Americas, right? Would make sense that they were kosher in that light.